Ashley Wagner

Been browsing the other skaters section and did not find any thread about her so I made this. Since she transferred to Mr Nicks she's improved a lot and has been on the upswing winning nationals and finally placing high in competitions. She's growing in confidence and it shows in her performances and in the programs she's doing. Her skating may not be to the liking of everyone here but she's coming into her own. I'm glad she's stepping up for the US and her hard work seems to be paying off.

Saw this tweet a while ago and got curious so I read it:

icenetwork.com wrote:

"I am not stepping on the ice to end up second." Read about how the skater always brings the drama...

Here's the link:
http://www.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20121117&content_id=40337756&vkey=ice_news

Reading that tweet it seemed a bit cocky but actually it isn't. The same thing happened during nationals when she said it was her nationals to lose but she backed up that talk with the win.

Last year's Black Swan and this year's Delilah -- she likes to portray characters:

Quote :

"I always like to choose pieces that tell a story," Wagner said. "Being there on the ice for four minutes, I also feel much better telling a story,"
---
"I got very positive reactions throughout," Wagner said. "The fact that Black Swan was so well received made me realize that I could really build upon my performing abilities."

This year, Delilah has given her new openings into that same direction.

"Delilah is a kind of a femme fatale who is trying to uncover Samson's secret,"

Seems this kind of character portrayal is a hit with judges aside from the audience. Yuna came to my mind definitely not just for her pros but also exhibitions. I wonder what Ashley will try to portray next season.

I do like this quote:

Quote :

"People do appreciate the technical aspect of skating," Wagner said. "See Julia [Lipnitskaia, who is standing in first place before Saturday's free program]; she is so strong in all the elements she does. But there is also a performing aspect to skating. Audiences come for it also. When you manage to combine those two dimensions, it makes you a better skater."

Your thoughts?


Lets see how she'll do in the free skate at TEB. Just a couple of hours more...

hm... she wants to portray someone who can't be trusted and i don't trust her all right. meaning, i definitely don't trust that she's humble there was nothing directly arrogant about what she says in that article, but i also wouldn't call it humble and it still doesn't steer clear away from the cocky zone. maybe because i read it in her "it's my nationals to lose!" tone of voice. she didn't have to bring up yulia in that interview.

Bringing up Julia shows in a way that she knows Julia is a thread to her now and in the future.
Maybe becoming used to winning is making her think 'I'm the queen', not like our Mao who never showed that kind of attitude.

i find it weird that she said she wants to bring back skating like what michelle kwan did. but having these interviews that makes me question her humility isn't going to bring american skating back to the michelle kwan era since michelle is so humble.

I don't see Ashley becoming the American queen. Ever. Figure skating is first and foremost about performance, and there are two aspects to performance - consistency and emotion. Michelle did both SPOT ON. Ashley is consistent... but is not emotionally good enough. If Christina Gao becomes consistent and if Mirai gets back to original form, those two could take US Figure Skating back to prominence. But I don't see Ashley doing it unless she becomes a better performer emotionally.

Alokya wrote:

I don't see Ashley becoming the American queen. Ever. Figure skating is first and foremost about performance, and there are two aspects to performance - consistency and emotion. Michelle did both SPOT ON. Ashley is consistent... but is not emotionally good enough. If Christina Gao becomes consistent and if Mirai gets back to original form, those two could take US Figure Skating back to prominence. But I don't see Ashley doing it unless she becomes a better performer emotionally.

Same here. It's so sad to see how Mirai has "fallen". i really thought she is going to be the next big thing in the US. I'm not saying this because I'm not Ashley's fan but to me she doesn't have an IT factor.

swan wrote:

i find it weird that she said she wants to bring back skating like what michelle kwan did. but having these interviews that makes me question her humility isn't going to bring american skating back to the michelle kwan era since michelle is so humble.

Well, Ashley was always talking how great she is, even before she went to Nicks, so maybe this is the way she makes herself feel confident. but success can easily get into ones head so...

As for Michelle, now don't hate me, but I always wondered how much of her personality was real and how much of it was a PR show.

zarinaballerina wrote:

Alokya wrote:

I don't see Ashley becoming the American queen. Ever. Figure skating is first and foremost about performance, and there are two aspects to performance - consistency and emotion. Michelle did both SPOT ON. Ashley is consistent... but is not emotionally good enough. If Christina Gao becomes consistent and if Mirai gets back to original form, those two could take US Figure Skating back to prominence. But I don't see Ashley doing it unless she becomes a better performer emotionally.

Same here. It's so sad to see how Mirai has "fallen". i really thought she is going to be the next big thing in the US. I'm not saying this because I'm not Ashley's fan but to me she doesn't have an IT factor.

swan wrote:

i find it weird that she said she wants to bring back skating like what michelle kwan did. but having these interviews that makes me question her humility isn't going to bring american skating back to the michelle kwan era since michelle is so humble.

Well, Ashley was always talking how great she is, even before she went to Nicks, so maybe this is the way she makes herself feel confident. but success can easily get into ones head so...

As for Michelle, now don't hate me, but I always wondered how much of her personality was real and how much of it was a PR show.

to be real, this goes for all athletes in general. but i like to give michelle the benefit of the doubt since i don't recall her doing anything too strange in public.

swan wrote:

zarinaballerina wrote:

Alokya wrote:

I don't see Ashley becoming the American queen. Ever. Figure skating is first and foremost about performance, and there are two aspects to performance - consistency and emotion. Michelle did both SPOT ON. Ashley is consistent... but is not emotionally good enough. If Christina Gao becomes consistent and if Mirai gets back to original form, those two could take US Figure Skating back to prominence. But I don't see Ashley doing it unless she becomes a better performer emotionally.

Same here. It's so sad to see how Mirai has "fallen". i really thought she is going to be the next big thing in the US. I'm not saying this because I'm not Ashley's fan but to me she doesn't have an IT factor.

swan wrote:

i find it weird that she said she wants to bring back skating like what michelle kwan did. but having these interviews that makes me question her humility isn't going to bring american skating back to the michelle kwan era since michelle is so humble.

Well, Ashley was always talking how great she is, even before she went to Nicks, so maybe this is the way she makes herself feel confident. but success can easily get into ones head so...

As for Michelle, now don't hate me, but I always wondered how much of her personality was real and how much of it was a PR show.

to be real, this goes for all athletes in general. but i like to give michelle the benefit of the doubt since i don't recall her doing anything too strange in public.

Based on her life past figure skating - I don't think it was a PR show. She could not be working with the US president and First Lady if she was just putting on an act. She is genuinely good at talking to people and handling tough situations. I give her credit for doing something beyond figure skating - that must have taken a lot of guts because if she had wanted to, she could have easily become a coach or made a lot of money with advertising. She is legendary here.

ddmm wrote:

Bringing up Julia shows in a way that she knows Julia is a thread to her now and in the future.
Maybe becoming used to winning is making her think 'I'm the queen', not like our Mao who never showed that kind of attitude.

Definitely! She might've brought Julia's name up uncousciously, but all the more it shows she almost scared the crap out of Ashley. Julia is not the kind of young talent that would pop up in the US I think...she reminds me more of some skaters 'back in the USSR~' days! So of course Julia is a threat to Ashley, but probabaly to everyone else as well. But I do think that both Ashley and Julia aren't modest if not arrogant, and that's precisely why they can maintain their confidence and skate as they've done so so far in GPS. Being modest is nice, but this kind of attitude, I believe would benefit Mao too so I'd like her to become able to trust herself more and more this season.

To be honest, although I haven't given up on Ashley, her skating style has changed quite alot over the past seasons, and I actually liked her more when she had that fragile touch, which I believe she had to sacrifice in order to become the strong powerful skater she is now. It made her overcome her nerve problems and stamina problems, so I'm happy for her on that, but as it was quite visible (at least to me) that she was trying hard to become a Mao type skater in the past; trying to skate as smooth as she can, trying to use her arms and fingers in a balletic way...I don't see much of that anymore in her performances, sadly. But I do think she's getting better in performing dynamic powerful pros, and I suppose that is the kind of skater who she was supposed to have been from the start.

In that sense, I think Ashley and Julia are kind of similar IMO...they're good at performing exciting energetic pros, but otherwise there isn't much to see. That's why of all girls, skaters like Ashley or some others who depend mostly on power and their confidence, must be the ones who are most threatened by Julia; what I'm trying to say is, that they are competing on the same type of plane. Once Julia masters larger jumps and can overcome growth period, in skill to say the least, she can beat them easily because they'd be competing with different types of pros maybe, but in the same kind of performing attitudes. But for skaters like Mao, Gao at her best, or Zijun...I think that would be another story. It would be very hard to compare a power performance like Julia's to their soft, smooth and elegant pros because they're so different. They're as different as much as Dai's performances are compared to Evan's.

Quote :

"People do appreciate the technical aspect of skating," Wagner said. "See Julia [Lipnitskaia, who is standing in first place before Saturday's free program]; she is so strong in all the elements she does. But there is also a performing aspect to skating. Audiences come for it also. When you manage to combine those two dimensions, it makes you a better skater."

I think Ashley is totally right in saying this, but the thing is, now that she is losing her abilities in sensitive expressions and has become more a power skater like a female version of Evan, it might be a matter of time for Julia to catch up in the 'performing aspect' of skating, and Ashley knows it. Once that happens, everyone will be in trouble, but skaters who can only amaze the audience with their speed and energy are the ones who will suffer most. Julia not only has power but she also has outstanding flexibility, which is one big weapon she has over Ashley and the others already which will never be lost even through her growth period.

I hate to have to say this, but if Ashley knows that the 'performing aspect' of skating is what makes one a better skater than someone like Julia, it's Ashley who needs brush up her 'performing aspect' more and more; take ballet lessons (if she hasn't already) or whatever etc., if she really wants to stay at the top. She should realise that she too had merely amazed the audience at TEB with speed, power and a clean skate...which should be thought of as the 'technical aspect' rather than the 'performing aspect' IMO. I too was very amazed by her FP, felt she deserved to win, but unfortunately not emotionally moved by her performance much...and moving people I believe is the true essence of the 'performing aspect'.

Mind you, she used to move me alot of times when she was only thought as a middle class skater, but kept on and on trying her best. I'm sure that was not the way she really wanted to move people, but that was part of her charm which I miss alot at this point.

On the Michelle Kwan thing:

First off, Michelle did not "bring back" skating. Skating was still popular when she started becoming successful and popular. Now, I think it's largely because of her that skating stayed as popular as it did for as long as it did. But no, it's not really accurate to say she brought it back.

This brings me to my next point: I think bringing skating's popularity back here is going to be a harder task than it was to maintain it, like Michelle did. For one reason, the scoring system: The old scoring system was casual viewer friendly, easy to understand, and it was common knowledge was 6.0 meant. The new system is complicated as hell. And for another reason: People were familiar with the US's deep pool of talented, consistent skaters when Michelle burst on the scene. Now majority of people here don't even know who Evan and Yuna are. There's no one the general public really knows or cares about now.

And what my main point is: I do like Ashley, and I think she has become a great skater, but IMO, she is not the next Michelle, and I don't think she's the one who's going to bring back skating. Whoever that skater is who brings back skating is going to have to be the next Michelle. At least. We all know the kind of skater Michelle was. I don't think I have to go on about how good she was, and how likable she was. One reason she was so popular and why she became America's sweetheart was because she got so good at such a young age and stayed consistent throughout her whole long career, winning almost everything. People love someone who's young, cute, super talented, has that special something, and wins all the time. It makes a great story. If Ashly were where she is now like 5 years ago when she was 16, then yes, maybe I could see her becoming huge. But Ashley is 21, and still not as good as Michelle was IMO.

Winning one US nationals? That's a torch that's been passed from skater to skater for years now, and we are used to seeing the US champ rise then fall. The US ladies field really is weak in general compared to previous years. It's full of up and coming skaters, skaters who are in slumps/ going through injuries, and inconsistent skaters. Back when Michelle was competing, the US ladies pool was more competitive. She competed against skaters like Tara, Sasha, Tonya, Sarah H., etc. and won 10/13. Ashley still has a lot to prove.

Also, if this special skater does ever come along again who "brings back" skating, I think she is going to need help (and yes, I do think it probably is going to have to be a girl. Although Nathan Chen is probably going to get as close as any guy could). And what I mean by that is, it would make her job easier if she wasn't the only great thing the US had going on. Michelle was certainly the driving force behind the public's interest in the sport for a long time, but there were other great skaters here too, and I think that did help. It would also help a lot if she had a good rivalry going on. We love drama here in the US.

Quote :

[quote="
In that sense, I think Ashley and Julia are kind of similar IMO...they're good at performing exciting energetic pros, but otherwise there isn't much to see. That's why of all girls, skaters like Ashley or some others who depend mostly on power and their confidence, must be the ones who are most threatened by Julia; what I'm trying to say is, that they are competing on the same type of plane. Once Julia masters larger jumps and can overcome growth period, in skill to say the least, she can beat them easily because they'd be competing with different types of pros maybe, but in the same kind of performing attitudes. But for skaters like Mao, Gao at her best, or Zijun...I think that would be another story. It would be very hard to compare a power performance like Julia's to their soft, smooth and elegant pros because they're so different. They're as different as much as Dai's performances are compared to Evan's.

Quote :

"People do appreciate the technical aspect of skating," Wagner said. "See Julia [Lipnitskaia, who is standing in first place before Saturday's free program]; she is so strong in all the elements she does. But there is also a performing aspect to skating. Audiences come for it also. When you manage to combine those two dimensions, it makes you a better skater."

I think Ashley is totally right in saying this, but the thing is, now that she is losing her abilities in sensitive expressions and has become more a power skater like a female version of Evan, it might be a matter of time for Julia to catch up in the 'performing aspect' of skating, and Ashley knows it. Once that happens, everyone will be in trouble, but skaters who can only amaze the audience with their speed and energy are the ones who will suffer most. Julia not only has power but she also has outstanding flexibility, which is one big weapon she has over Ashley and the others already which will never be lost even through her growth period.

[/quote]

I would have to argue with you about this, cause i think Mao is just as much a powerful skater as she is graceful, lyrical, and light on the ice. when Mao bursted into the scene doing 3A and 3-3's as if it was thee easiest thing in the world, that's a clear indication to her beeing a powerful skater, ofcourse her body is tiny and ballerina like (meaning not the kind of skater people usuelly would notify as powerful, like midori) but that view has changed with time.

i think Mao has been more of a power skater, her technical content through the years shows that she is a powerhouse, having skatet to the most technically difficult programs with 3A and several 3-3 in the same program, and beeing the female skater who has gotten the most 3A's ratified, being the skater who landed most 3A's in the same competition, repeating that record several competitions..... all this is evidence that Mao is a power skater, but because she is a complete skater, elegant, light, smooth, and generally gentle to the ice, people tend to forget the elements (like i do) and just enjoy her performance and her as an artist more!

but that hasn't always been like that, the judges in general also viewed her more as a technical skater, her tech score has always been the highest, it's only recently the judges have been given her the PCS she deserves!

but i do understand your point of julia and ashley beeing only power skaters, and lacking in the presentation field, but that's because confidence helps a skater keep his/her nerves under control and deliever but doesn't hide the lacks in the artistic field, especially when the skaters skating skills are bad or the the real connection to the music isn't there. I recently feel that ashleys programs truly are like that, with posing, posing and more posing without the real connection to the music, her programs just come across as superficial to me!

Guess who saw this on local news today as I was watching?

http://www.king5.com/sports/US-figure-skater-eyes-2014-Sochi-medal-stand-207959541.html

Thanx for posting this!

So, Patrick thinks her placement on the (olympic) podium is guaranteed? Well, flesh news Patrick, she ain't you. I bet he thinks he's guaranteed to win, and he's probably right.
Honestly, I believe the Oly's podium is already set (provided that the top three don't have any meltdowns) and it's Mao Asada, Carolina kostner and Yuna Kim in random order. Though I wouldn't mind one bit, seeing Mao in first in Sochi.

Does Ashley have an outside chance? Absolutely, but so does Gracie, Adelina, Zijun (if judging would become fair) and Liza (or whoever is going to make it on the russian team).

Honestly, I'm hoping that Gracie will be awesome this season, she's better than Ashley, she only needs to conquer her nerves and learn how to actually skate to the music. And as much as it pains me to say this, I wish and hope that Mao would/will show the same level of confidence as Ashley when on the ice. It's no secret that I don't like Ashley and am hoping for Gracie to kick her butt big time , but this girl sure does have confidence, I have to give her that. And IMO, this confidence is also influencing the judges in giving her better PCS (with the help of USFSA of course )

And I know this is OT, but hearing Patrick being described as a 3 time wold champion is so wrong... I hope for Russia to show a giant middle finger to Skate Canada in Sochi, unless Chan will actually skate great, I don't want to see him crowned as oly's champion.

And confirmed - Ashley will be travelling and working with Rafael.

http://www.usfsa.org/Story.asp?id=49321&type=media

Alokya wrote:

And confirmed - Ashley will be travelling and working with Rafael.

http://www.usfsa.org/Story.asp?id=49321&type=media

I thought this is going to happen the moment it was announced that Nicks  no longer wants to travel, though, does this mean that he also isn't going to Sochi?! I assumed that he won't be going to GP's/GPF and 4CC, but will go to Nats and Oly's.

According to skating lessons twitter, Adam is going to train at Toyota full time from september, so rumours are that Rafa is also going to relocate there. This will make it easier for Ashley, if true.

I hate to say this, but Mao better clean up her Ur's, cause Rafa is a great jump speciallist and I see Ashley starting her season with 3-3. This will only make her already great confidence grow even more.

How I wish Mao hadn't left Rafael.

zarinaballerina wrote:

I thought this is going to happen the moment it was announced that Nicks  no longer wants to travel, though, does this mean that he also isn't going to Sochi?! I assumed that he won't be going to GP's/GPF and 4CC, but will go to Nats and Oly's.

No, I don't think Nicks will go to Sochi, IIRC, long distance traveling was the main reason Nicks wanted to retire. Not sure of US Nationals, though I don't think anyone stays with Nicks (other than Ashley) after his announcement of retirement.

It's interesting...so the first chance for Mao to be against Ashley in the competition will be at JO...

zarinaballerina wrote:

Alokya wrote:

And confirmed - Ashley will be travelling and working with Rafael.

http://www.usfsa.org/Story.asp?id=49321&type=media

I thought this is going to happen the moment it was announced that Nicks  no longer wants to travel, though, does this mean that he also isn't going to Sochi?! I assumed that he won't be going to GP's/GPF and 4CC, but will go to Nats and Oly's.

According to skating lessons twitter, Adam is going to train at Toyota full time from september, so rumours are that Rafa is also going to relocate there. This will make it easier for Ashley, if true.

I hate to say this, but Mao better clean up her Ur's, cause Rafa is a great jump speciallist and I see Ashley starting her season with 3-3. This will only make her already great confidence grow even more.

How I wish Mao hadn't left Rafael.

I also wish that Mao'd have a jumping specialist aside from Mr Sato. What was Mao's reason for leaving Rafael? I didn't follow her until 2010. He's a great jumping specialist. His students are excellent at jumping.

Quote :

I also wish that Mao'd have a jumping specialist aside from Mr Sato. What was Mao's reason for leaving Rafael? I didn't follow her until 2010. He's a great jumping specialist. His students are excellent at jumping.

Akiko's coach, Hiroshi Nagakubo, was her jumping specialist from June till September 2010. She stopped working with him when she started working with Nobuo Sato. I thought he was a good person for the job seeing as how he helped Akiko improve her jumps.

pearlyriver wrote:

I also wish that Mao'd have a jumping specialist aside from Mr Sato. What was Mao's reason for leaving Rafael? I didn't follow her until 2010. He's a great jumping specialist. His students are excellent at jumping.

I don't think she ever explained why she left Rafael, I could be wrong though. There was this weird story where Mao decided to stay in Japan after 2007 Nats and prepair for 4 CC there and Rafael was supposed to join her for about 2 weeks before the start of 4CC, but suddenly he canceled, so Mao went alone and she was also alone at worlds. I think they stopped working together before 4CC.

Also Mao's mom at that time, had already been very ill for years, so there's a speculation that this is the main reason Mao returned and stayed in Japan only working abroad part time. i wish she could've stayed with rafael and worked with him during the summer and maybe before 4CC/worlds/Olympics. Her jumps were at their best when she was with Rafael.

Ma gurl Ashley right here... is tawkin' more about her views against Russia's anti-gay propaganda law.
She even tawkin' about how she's gonna paint her nails in the rainbow/gay colours and wear rainbow-colored earrings. How awesome would dat be?       

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/christinebrennan/2014/01/08/ashley-wagner-speaks-out-russia-anti-gay-law/4374625/

About time someone addressed this issue publicly. We livin' in 2014. Somebody need to tell Putin and all them ignorant rednecks in the world that gay rights ain't somethin' to be swept under the rug.

Ashley   She's very brave and classy. I think she has a great and supportive friend behind her. I read that another American Olympic hopeful (name not disclosed) also wanted to speak out, but was advised by his/her team to keep quiet.  

I'm cheering for her at Nats! The time difference is killing me (again).    

Please don't get me wrong, I HATE what Putin has done and I find this law absolutely appalling, and kudos to Ashley for speaking out. However, part of me can't help but wonder how much is she doing this because she believes in it (i know a member or members of her family is/are gay) and how much, because of the publicity this will bring.    

As for painting her nails and wearing rainbow earings, she needs to be careful. IOC rules are very clear when it comes to athletes and any kind of promotion, protests or political stances.

Though I would believe her more (in her sincerity) had she just gone to Sochi and wear earrings or painted nails, without announcing it weeks in advance. Just my two cents.

Adam Rippon is her best friend, she said it a lot of times, he coreographed her horrible ex program   . I don´t know if he speak about his sexuality but clearly he don´t hide his orientation, I think is sure to say it, so I think Ashley is doing it more because her believes and I don´t see any reason for doubt about that, if she wants publicity she could do a sex tape as everyone.

chapis wrote:

Adam Rippon is her best friend, she said it a lot of times, he coreographed her horrible ex program   . I don´t know if he speak about his sexuality but clearly he don´t hide his orientation, I think is sure to say it, so I think Ashley is doing it more because her believes and I don´t see any reason for doubt about that, if she wants publicity she could do a sex tape as everyone.

I don't think Adam has come out at least not publicly.    I didn't mean to imply that the publicity is the only reason she's speaking out. Due to her situation (family and friends being members of LGBT) I do believe that she does it because of her believes, I was just wondering how much the publicity is also part of this. It's a cynic in me, I can't help it. This will surely get her noticed, though it can also backfire.

About the sex tape; IMO, there are better ways to get yourself noticed, without the tape "accidentaly" getting leaked. I still can't believe people get famous over this... (Kim K)  

Which ex did Adam choreograph for Ashley?

In the gala of Skate america 2013 she said Adam Rippon coreographed her ex, but I didn´t like it   , I don´t want to watch it again . I don´t know if this is the ex she skated all season.